Don't Even Go There
The blogosphere is a pretty strange place. I sometimes wonder, as I sit here writing, what the hell I am talking about. It's about the writing life, the muse, the struggles, the real-life inspirations. It's about friendships formed and writers discovered.
A couple of weeks ago, by merrily following a set of links, I posted on another blog. Doesn't matter which one. And I got a nasty, nasty response from someone there named "Anonymous." That Anonymous really gets around, eh?
The lovely Natalie Damschroder, who drops by here from time to time, emailed me offline about something else, and ended up offering me kind words along the lines of, in life we can meet people we disagree with, but we can hopefully do so graciously.
Now this happened. Rush Limbaugh said Michael J. Fox was ACTING about his Parkinson's disease. Now, if you already knew this, then you likely have an opinion about it. If you DIDN'T know about this, I am sure you have your mouth open right now, because man, you cannot make sh*t like this up. Ann Coulter wrote of a group of 9/11 widows: I’ve never seen people enjoying their husbands’ deaths so much. And a core group of Internet bloggers applauded that statement.
What has happened? When did we become a nation of bloggers and talking heads and emailers who flame people and run our mouths with no sense of humanity? If you have an opinion, great. But there is a PERSON on the other side of that blog comment.
Of course, I don't write about politics (to avoid giving myself an aneurysm), so this blog tends to be pretty friendly. I love all of you guys! I enjoy all your comments and I cheer for your triumphs and root for you when you're in a tough spot in your wips. But we're readers, writers, communicators. Is it ME? ("Yup, the lack of coffee is kickin' in!") Is the world really so nasty that we can't speak and write nicely to each other out there beyond this blog? Buddhists try to be peaceful, so of course I do not believe we should be at war. Yet I know soldiers there, including a cousin of my significant other. I send things to the troops. But post something about peace in some forums and you will find bile spewed at you the likes of which I have never seen. Why? What has happened?
Visit Amazon. Look at reviews for books . . . I think I have one bad one, maybe two, out of a hundred. Not bad. But go look at reviews for books that have two or three stars. You would think that rather than a person shelling out $10.95 for a book they didn't like, that they had amputated a limb as payment. The outrage, the drama, the vicious comments! Not even, "I didn't like this book because . . . " but "How did this author get published? He is a pathetic hack."
So what was the turning point? Has the anonymity of the Internet, the fact that you don't have to look someone in the face as you slam them . . . made us all more confident bashers?
There are some things, when I speak to others . . . that I won't discuss. I "won't even go there." I try not to even talk about Dafur, the war, and a dozen other things that I routinely pray about or cry in private over, or discuss with the people I love who GET that it's our common humanity that binds us.
Thoughts? What is it that unleashes the viciousness online? The lack of compassion in the realm of politics, the media, and the arts?
A couple of weeks ago, by merrily following a set of links, I posted on another blog. Doesn't matter which one. And I got a nasty, nasty response from someone there named "Anonymous." That Anonymous really gets around, eh?
The lovely Natalie Damschroder, who drops by here from time to time, emailed me offline about something else, and ended up offering me kind words along the lines of, in life we can meet people we disagree with, but we can hopefully do so graciously.
Now this happened. Rush Limbaugh said Michael J. Fox was ACTING about his Parkinson's disease. Now, if you already knew this, then you likely have an opinion about it. If you DIDN'T know about this, I am sure you have your mouth open right now, because man, you cannot make sh*t like this up. Ann Coulter wrote of a group of 9/11 widows: I’ve never seen people enjoying their husbands’ deaths so much. And a core group of Internet bloggers applauded that statement.
What has happened? When did we become a nation of bloggers and talking heads and emailers who flame people and run our mouths with no sense of humanity? If you have an opinion, great. But there is a PERSON on the other side of that blog comment.
Of course, I don't write about politics (to avoid giving myself an aneurysm), so this blog tends to be pretty friendly. I love all of you guys! I enjoy all your comments and I cheer for your triumphs and root for you when you're in a tough spot in your wips. But we're readers, writers, communicators. Is it ME? ("Yup, the lack of coffee is kickin' in!") Is the world really so nasty that we can't speak and write nicely to each other out there beyond this blog? Buddhists try to be peaceful, so of course I do not believe we should be at war. Yet I know soldiers there, including a cousin of my significant other. I send things to the troops. But post something about peace in some forums and you will find bile spewed at you the likes of which I have never seen. Why? What has happened?
Visit Amazon. Look at reviews for books . . . I think I have one bad one, maybe two, out of a hundred. Not bad. But go look at reviews for books that have two or three stars. You would think that rather than a person shelling out $10.95 for a book they didn't like, that they had amputated a limb as payment. The outrage, the drama, the vicious comments! Not even, "I didn't like this book because . . . " but "How did this author get published? He is a pathetic hack."
So what was the turning point? Has the anonymity of the Internet, the fact that you don't have to look someone in the face as you slam them . . . made us all more confident bashers?
There are some things, when I speak to others . . . that I won't discuss. I "won't even go there." I try not to even talk about Dafur, the war, and a dozen other things that I routinely pray about or cry in private over, or discuss with the people I love who GET that it's our common humanity that binds us.
Thoughts? What is it that unleashes the viciousness online? The lack of compassion in the realm of politics, the media, and the arts?
posted by Erica Orloff at 6:40 AM
22 Comments:
The ability to go anonymous, pure and simple.
I try to ignore venom and ignorance, whether it's from R.L. or A.C. or an anonymous troll on the internet.
Some people seem to thrive on stirring up shit. They love the attention. If everyone ignored them, they would dry up and blow away like the weeds that they are. And I'm not necessarily picking on the conservatives here. Just the radical factions on both sides.
I have nothing against a healthy, intelligent debate. People have different opinions and that's okay, even good. But when compromise isn't an option, when debate turns to hate, it's all a waste of time.
I don't let 'em waste mine.
I think it's a need for attention, for validation. It's so much easier to hop on a bandwagon of hatred than to be the lone ranger who says, "Wait a minute? What about love thy enemy or do unto others or judge lest you be judged? Or heck, just plain old good manners?"
I really want to see the documentary about the Dixie Chicks and yet I don't because it will fire me up! I admit that I'm always tempted to go there and unleash my anger at ignorance and hatred. But then I would just be adding kindling to the fire so instead, I'd rather put out positive vibes. Maybe they get snuffed out by the negative vibes but that will just make me try harder.
I've always said the internet is a licence to be rude (in ways we'd never be rude in real life).
BTW (and totally off topic) I found a coffee substitute I'm going to try! (the doc says I have to get clean *sigh*)
May:
I think so. Someone once (and I wish I could atrribute it properly) said the Internet was a great equalizer. I write to you, you write to me. We don't know what color each other are, what our religion, if you are in a wheelchair or if you are who you say you are (you being a proverbial "you"). There is truth to that, but it also brings out the cretins.
E
Jude:
I agree.
I come from a "politics of peace" perspective. One of the biggest things to me, of course, is China's destruction of Tibet. It bothers me immensely. But I know enough to afford people the space of their own beliefs, just as, personalizing it, I know to afford people their tastes in books and movies, their lifestyle choices, and so on.
E
Mary:
I do think some of it really is old-fashioned manners. I was raised by the "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all" rule.
E
Amie:
What is it?! Do tell!
I am drinking copious amounts of green tea from morning to night.
E
I think it is a trend so pervasive in our society now. So many of my kid's contemporaries (including my neice) are being raised by parents who don't teach them good manners and decorum. That is also reinforced by people in the media, like my favorite person Rush Limbaugh, and "reality shows" that glorify rude behavior.
There are shows aimed at teenagers that I think are absolutely disgusting because of the behavior of the people on the show -screaming at each other, cursing, etc. I'm in no way a prude, but all the in-your-face, let-it-all-hang-out-for-the-whole-world-to-see stuff in the media these days is just too much. How mortifying it will be for some of these girls to look back at their 20's when everything is caught on video or web cam anymore.
I think everyone feels that they're allowed to say whatever is on their minds, regardless of whether it is rude or insulting to anyone else and the anonymity of the web promotes that.
I really see it when trying to hire decent people for my company - so many of the applicants I would never send out to represent my company!
Nina:
Really well said! My kids are being raised to be "kind." So the other day, one of my kids made a joking comment to her brother "Well, Du-uh!" And I said, "That's unkind. Apologize." Of course, I got the "But that's not a big deal, everyone says things like that, or says 'stupid,'" or what have you. And I said, "But WE don't."
As for reality shows and all that, my father always had a dim view of humanity. Most Americans, he says, are sheep, they're dumb, they don't bother to scratch below the surface and learn the root causes of various world conflicts, whatever. I try not to buy into the "people are stupid" thing. But I the older I get . . . I have to sometimes think he is right.
E
Anonymity and a lack of accountability, hands down.
On the net, Anonymous can say anything, without being held responsible or accountable.
There is no expectation for Anonymous to be respectful, because once someone dons the mask of Anonymity, the need to be respectful and professional is stripped away.
Erica - keep that up with your kids! It does pay off. My daughter found out that my hard nosed attitude pays off last weekend in New York. We were invited to spend the weekend with my husband's cousin and his partner.
Ralph is a fashion designer for a leading line of wedding gowns and invited us to attend his fall show. Her favorite (and that of many teens) expression used to be "that's so gay" until I finally broke her of it. That would have been extremely embarrasing if she'd let loose with that this past weekend.
As it was, she got to see another slice of life and had a fantastic time - & made all her Ohio girlfriends jealous to boot!
Hi Kathy:
You're right. There's no expectation that Anonymous be a decent person.
E
Nina:
LOVED that! I have more gay friends than straight. So my kids, as we put it, "Love the gays." We love my "queenie" friends and my trannie friends, and so on. My younger daughter recently became friends with a girl who is from a religious household that is SO not okay with gays. And she has come home talking about sin and so on, and I've just had to let her know we're all God's children, act accordingly.
E
I find it hard to believe none of you knew rude, obnoxious, hate-filled people before the Internet.
My naivete is going to be showing again, I'm sure, but...I don't think people are any different than they ever were. They just have more forums for it. Sure, there's SOME degree of release with the anonymity and lack of true confrontation we have here, but people in general are the way they are and always have been.
I also think there's a vocal minority. I used to hear tons of horror stories about kids and teenagers, and when my kids got to that point, I found that at least in my area, it's completely untrue. I go to school events and the kids are overwhelmingly well-behaved and polite.
Another example is New Yorkers 15, 20 years ago. The whole WORLD just KNEW that New Yorkers are rude and hostile and would watch you be murdered without doing anything (and didn't the original situation that started that labeling occur in the 50s, anyway?) But I never knew NYers to be anything but great, and I wasn't even a native, but a hated daytripper. :)
I just think we have more media outlets, more people trying to BE media outlets, more opportunities for "celebrity" of any sort, and that makes stereotyping easier, and makes it easier for us to extrapolate that if 10 people online are being a certain way, that means 100 million of us are that way.
If that makes any sense.
Well, Natalie, I disagree 100%.
I know PLENTY of rude people. People who cut in line at the grocery store or cut you off on the highway. PTA moms who are snooty. Dads who are jackasses at Little League, whatever. See them EVERY day.
BUT, I have gone through my entire life (and to you all who know me, you know I've seen and done a lot) and can count on one hand the number of nasty confrontations of the nature that I see online--i.e., the vicious name-calling and vicious slurs and statements and so on that proliferate . . . I do not witness THAT level of vileness in person. I disagree with you, you with me, we argue, we debate . . . but I have not, that I can recall, been in the presence of two people at a PTA meeting or an event, or a dinner party and, over a disagreement, seen one woman say to the other,. "You must really be enjoying the fact your husband's dead" (a la Coulter). I mean in normal society, that would be considered so vile as to make people of ANY walk of life or beliefs gasp in utter horror and disgust. Or "You liberals must want to let a bunch of Moslems bomb every one of our buildings"--yet you can see that on blogs. (And I am sure insane statements come from the opposite camp, too.) It's not that things don't get heated . . . but the viciousness rises to a new level when someone has a computer between them and the person they are confronting. In my humble opinion, anyway.
Peace,
E
Erica, it's sad. I think some blame should go to the 24 hr. news media. Before, you had early morning news, afternoon-maybe a 30 min. break, then evening news. They had to focus on the "real" stories. Now, I channel flip and they're talking about Paris Hilton on the news! What's with that? It's gossip central now. I don't buy into it, it's toxic. I hate what's going on in Tibet too, Dafur, so many others. I'm so disappointed in politics I cringe whenever campaign time rolls around. It's all based on greed, and who can pull the wool over the American public. I live a pretty simple life, and prefer it. My two daughters are raising my grandchildren to be kind, and honest, the oldest is eight now. Sometimes, I worry where it's all heading, though, this place we live in. Everyone wants to be right, and that's insane. Share ideas, beliefs if you want but don't force them on someone else. Just BE.
Hello, I agree with you, Erica. The internet has turned the 'public space' far more vicious than it used to be. We certainly weren't a perfect society by any means, but prior to the internet there were unspoken and informal rules for public behavior and most people adhered to those rules. Yes, there were exceptions, but most people were at least polite in most areas of public life. Sadly, that has changed and not for the better. But I also believe that things go in cycles and I'm beginning to see a bit more decorum and politeness, even on the internet. But I still don't read my Amazon reviews - I don't mind if someone doesn't like my book, but they don't have to be so vicious about it. Just don't buy the next one.
Cheryl/Emily
Oh my heck. I think I love you. (I got to your post via Heather Brewer's blog)
I can't talk about Dafur to anyone without either going ballistic or going into a hopeless spiral of helplessness, or hopelessness.
Great blog. Thanks for your wonderful, poetic way of expressing things.
lisa
ladonna"
Everyone wants to be right. That is SO true!!! One of the best lessons I have learned is I don't have to be. I can just "be" with myself and my beliefs and be Ok with other people having their.
lisa:
Love ya back! LOL!! I am the same way over some things that seem, to me, to be obvious about helping humanity.
E
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